High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

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High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Steve Harmony
My wife and I each have a MacBook Pro and an iPhone, all running the latest version of their respective OS. We recently installed a satellite Internet system at our new house and are seeing excessive usage. Our plan gives us 15 GB per month, and after four days we're already up to 4.1. We're not streaming video or downloading huge files. I can account for 1-2 GB due to iOS App Store downloads and maybe an 8.4 update on Betty's iPhone, but how can I track down the remaining bandwidth usage?

Our satellite ISP, Exede Internet, says it's "iTunes streaming." Well, we don't stream iTunes and haven't turned on Apple Music. Just now I told the App Store apps on both Macs to not automatically check for updates. What else can I do to track down the excessive bandwidth usage?

On our plan, Exede gives us 15 GB for the first six months then it drops down to 5. Web usage and email are not included in the data cap, but downloads and streaming are.

What do you think might be happening?

Steve


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Peter Lane
iCloud backup on? We've had similar struggles with Hughes net Satelite also with 15 gig plan. iOS behaves very differently with wifi and cellular. Assumes wifi unlimited and cellular not.

Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 5, 2015, at 7:29 PM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> My wife and I each have a MacBook Pro and an iPhone, all running the latest version of their respective OS. We recently installed a satellite Internet system at our new house and are seeing excessive usage. Our plan gives us 15 GB per month, and after four days we're already up to 4.1. We're not streaming video or downloading huge files. I can account for 1-2 GB due to iOS App Store downloads and maybe an 8.4 update on Betty's iPhone, but how can I track down the remaining bandwidth usage?
>
> Our satellite ISP, Exede Internet, says it's "iTunes streaming." Well, we don't stream iTunes and haven't turned on Apple Music. Just now I told the App Store apps on both Macs to not automatically check for updates. What else can I do to track down the excessive bandwidth usage?
>
> On our plan, Exede gives us 15 GB for the first six months then it drops down to 5. Web usage and email are not included in the data cap, but downloads and streaming are.
>
> What do you think might be happening?
>
> Steve
>
>
> ____________TidBITS Talk Participation Guidelines____________
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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Steve Harmony
iCloud backup was not on. You're right, Apple assumes wifi is unlimited. I've been going through all our devices turning off anything iCloud related. Back to pre-cloud days until I can figure this out. Exede's suggested solution was to pay twice as much for the 150 GB plan. Thanks a lot, guys!

How about Google Drive? We're using that some but just for sharing text documents.

Steve

On Wed, 05 Aug 2015 20:16:48 -0400, Peter Lane wrote:
> iCloud backup on? We've had similar struggles with Hughes net
> Satelite also with 15 gig plan. iOS behaves very differently with
> wifi and cellular. Assumes wifi unlimited and cellular not.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Alex Forbes-2

> On Aug 5, 2015, at 9:08 PM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> iCloud backup was not on. You're right, Apple assumes wifi is unlimited.

I find a few interesting apps in the App Store (search term “wi-fi”) that may help monitor and track usage, bandwidth and even mapping. Is anyone using one or more of these?

Alex


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Franconi Enrico

> On 06 Aug 2015, at 06:18, Alex Forbes <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Aug 5, 2015, at 9:08 PM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>>
>> iCloud backup was not on. You're right, Apple assumes wifi is unlimited.
>
> I find a few interesting apps in the App Store (search term “wi-fi”) that may help monitor and track usage, bandwidth and even mapping. Is anyone using one or more of these?

TidBITS covered positively one of these apps: http://tidbits.com/article/15808 <http://tidbits.com/article/15808> "TripMode Prevents Unwanted Internet Data Usage on a Tethered Mac"
cheers
—e.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Steve Harmony
On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 07:37:46 +0200, Enrico Franconi wrote:
>
> TidBITS covered positively one of these apps:
> http://tidbits.com/article/15808 <http://tidbits.com/article/15808>
> "TripMode Prevents Unwanted Internet Data Usage on a Tethered Mac"

Thanks for the suggestion, Enrico. Looks like that's just the tool I need!

Steve


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Peter Lane
In reply to this post by Steve Harmony
I believe any cloud service could be an issue. Dropbox updating etc.



Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 6, 2015, at 12:08 AM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> iCloud backup was not on. You're right, Apple assumes wifi is unlimited. I've been going through all our devices turning off anything iCloud related. Back to pre-cloud days until I can figure this out. Exede's suggested solution was to pay twice as much for the 150 GB plan. Thanks a lot, guys!
>
> How about Google Drive? We're using that some but just for sharing text documents.
>
> Steve
>
>> On Wed, 05 Aug 2015 20:16:48 -0400, Peter Lane wrote:
>> iCloud backup on? We've had similar struggles with Hughes net
>> Satelite also with 15 gig plan. iOS behaves very differently with
>> wifi and cellular. Assumes wifi unlimited and cellular not.
>
>
> ____________TidBITS Talk Participation Guidelines____________
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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Papa Gordie
In reply to this post by Steve Harmony
>
> On Aug 5, 2015, at 5:29 PM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> My wife and I each have a MacBook Pro and an iPhone, all running the latest version of their respective OS. We recently installed a satellite Internet system at our new house and are seeing excessive usage. Our plan gives us 15 GB per month, and after four days we're already up to 4.1. We're not streaming video or downloading huge files. I can account for 1-2 GB due to iOS App Store downloads and maybe an 8.4 update on Betty's iPhone, but how can I track down the remaining bandwidth usage?

I did read ahead and note your mention of disabling anything iCloud but still think it worth your while to confirm exactly how photos are/were being handled so I suggest checking specific Photos settings on all your devices. Photos may well have defaulted to upload all Photos to iCloud.

Gord


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Steve Harmony
This morning's usage report looks better, we only used 300 MB yesterday. I've cut off about every cloud-related service I can think of. I'll be trying TripMode soon.

Steve

On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 07:26:19 -0600, Papa Gordie wrote:

> I did read ahead and note your mention of disabling anything iCloud
> but still think it worth your while to confirm exactly how photos
> are/were being handled so I suggest checking specific Photos settings
> on all your devices. Photos may well have defaulted to upload all
> Photos to iCloud.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Mike Noonan-2
In your local menu bar go to DropBox/ gear /Preferences/Account/Selective Sync:   where you can choose the folder(s) that you want to sync.  One could use this function to spread out the DropBox uploads over time to control your usage.
Mike


On Aug 6, 2015, at 7:13 AM, Steve Harmony <[hidden email]> wrote:

This morning's usage report looks better, we only used 300 MB yesterday. I've cut off about every cloud-related service I can think of. I'll be trying TripMode soon.

Steve

On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 07:26:19 -0600, Papa Gordie wrote:

> I did read ahead and note your mention of disabling anything iCloud
> but still think it worth your while to confirm exactly how photos
> are/were being handled so I suggest checking specific Photos settings
> on all your devices. Photos may well have defaulted to upload all
> Photos to iCloud.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Peter Tuft
A few months ago myself and my brother had a similar problem.  For both of us the culprit was nsurlsessiond, whatever that is.  Despite a couple of helpful suggestions from this list we were unable to solve it.  In my case after a couple of weeks or more it finished doing whatever it was doing and usage went back to normal.  I think my brother eventually managed to get a solution through Apple support but I don’t have the details.  It was intensely annoying, and also expensive, for both of us.

Peter T.




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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

David Ross
On 8/7/15 4:23 AM, Peter Tuft wrote:
> A few months ago myself and my brother had a similar problem.  For
> both of us the culprit was nsurlsessiond, whatever that is.  Despite
> a couple of helpful suggestions from this list we were unable to
> solve it.  In my case after a couple of weeks or more it finished
> doing whatever it was doing and usage went back to normal.  I think
> my brother eventually managed to get a solution through Apple support
> but I don’t have the details.  It was intensely annoying, and also
> expensive, for both of us.

This is the process that syncs your iCloud information. Which is to the
point of the other suggestions of turning off everything dealing with
iCloud.

In thinking about this, while I'm a big fan of IMAP for all email, IMAP
would be a terrible way to access email on this kind of internet connection.

POP or an in house IMAP email server looks like a better way to go.

Not sure what one would do if using Google or Office 365 for email.
Maybe stick to the web interfaces.

David


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Rodney
On Aug 7, 2015, at 13:19, David Ross <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Not sure what one would do if using Google or Office 365 for email.

I’ve never used Office 365, but AFAIK, Gmail still supports POP.  If you tell either Mac or iOS mail that you’re creating an account to access Gmail, it does do IMAP by default.

> Maybe stick to the web interfaces.

That would be my recommendation.

There is not an option for changing a “Gmail" account from IMAP to POP.  You’d have to create a new POP version of the account and afterwards delete the IMAP account from the local machine.  To create a POP Gmail account, it would probably be necessary to tell Mail to create the account as “Other”, then fill in the Google server information manually.  I think that generic instructions for setting up a POP account are still on the Gmail site, but I didn’t look.

After a POP account was created, I’m not sure whether or not all the old mail would download at once (resulting in a huge download hit), or only future unread mail.  Either way, there’d be a lot of initial confusion.  I went in the opposite direction quite a few years ago when I switched my Gmail account from POP to IMAP.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Paul Schinder
In reply to this post by David Ross

> On Aug 7, 2015, at 7:19 AM, David Ross <[hidden email]> wrote:
> In thinking about this, while I'm a big fan of IMAP for all email, IMAP would be a terrible way to access email on this kind of internet connection.

Unless you routinely attach huge video files, why worry about trivial amounts of data?  If I remember right, he said he had 15 Gb a month.  What’s the typical email, 1k?  Even with the IMAP overhead email without attachments, even what are essentially inline web pages that one gets nowadays, can’t take up very much bandwidth.  If you’re worried about bandwidth/usage, focus on streaming video and cloud backups.

>
> POP or an in house IMAP email server looks like a better way to go.
>
> Not sure what one would do if using Google or Office 365 for email. Maybe stick to the web interfaces.
>
> David
>


--
Paul Schinder
[hidden email]






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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Rodney
On Aug 7, 2015, at 13:59, Paul Schinder <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Unless you routinely attach huge video files, why worry about trivial amounts of data?

Only the OP knows how much data we’re talking about here.  David’s (I think) suggestion to look at email may not be helpful in his particular case, but was worth making.

> If I remember right, he said he had 15 Gb a month. What’s the typical email, 1k?

That would depend on the type of mail the OP gets the most of.  Even if his typical email is 1k, if he has several years worth of it, and then adds a new machine, all that mail will sync via IMAP.

>  Even with the IMAP overhead email without attachments, even what are essentially inline web pages that one gets nowadays, can’t take up very much bandwidth.

That’s assuming the OP doesn't choose to download the graphics, and we don’t know anything about the OP’s use of attachments.

> If you’re worried about bandwidth/usage, focus on streaming video and cloud backups.

Yes, that’s the place to start, but if the usage savings aren’t adequate it certainly doesn’t hurt to look at email.


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Curtis Wilcox
In reply to this post by David Ross
On Aug 7, 2015, at 7:19 AM, David Ross <[hidden email]> wrote:
> In thinking about this, while I'm a big fan of IMAP for all email, IMAP would be a terrible way to access email on this kind of internet connection.
>
> POP or an in house IMAP email server looks like a better way to go.

I think it depends. Most people's email isn't as "weighty" as other kinds of data. If you start your IMAP client's cache on an unmetered connection, you'll only use metered bandwidth when you receive new email, same as with POP. Depending on the IMAP client you choose (i.e. not Mail.app), you can unsubscribe to certain folders so you never need to download them. To reduce bandwidth, you can have the client not to store Trash or Drafts on the server (you could do the same with Sent but I wouldn't recommend it).




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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Doug Miller
In reply to this post by David Ross
On Fri, Aug 7, 2015 at 7:19 AM, David Ross <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> In thinking about this, while I'm a big fan of IMAP for all email, IMAP
> would be a terrible way to access email on this kind of internet connection.
>
> POP or an in house IMAP email server looks like a better way to go.
>

​I've personally switched to just using Gmail's web interface for email
myself, but I think that these discussions of which email protocol to use
are unnecessary in this case. As was originally stated in the first email,

Web usage and email are not included in the data cap, but downloads and
> streaming are.​




Doug
​ Miller​


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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Curtis Wilcox
In reply to this post by Paul Schinder
On Aug 7, 2015, at 7:59 AM, Paul Schinder <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Unless you routinely attach huge video files, why worry about trivial amounts of data?  If I remember right, he said he had 15 Gb a month.  What’s the typical email, 1k?  Even with the IMAP overhead email without attachments, even what are essentially inline web pages that one gets nowadays, can’t take up very much bandwidth.  If you’re worried about bandwidth/usage, focus on streaming video and cloud backups.

He wrote "15 GB per month" which I assume means 15 gigabytes. "15 Gb a month," with a lowercase 'b' would be 15 gigabits, one eighth the bandwidth. The typical email is a lot bigger than 1 kilobyte, even excluding images that may not be automatically downloaded. The only email in my inbox that are 1KB contain a single sentence and a URL. Email tends to have much bigger headers than they used to and HTML formatting is the norm. Your email to the list is ~9.5KB, ~2KB is the base64 encoded body and the rest is headers.

Nevertheless, I agree that unless someone exchange a lot of larger file attachments, email isn't going to be as much trouble for your bandwidth as other services. The average web page is over 1500KB, you might save more bandwidth if you can block web fonts than you would by not using an IMAP client.




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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Curtis Wilcox
In reply to this post by Doug Miller
On Aug 7, 2015, at 9:47 AM, Doug Miller <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ​I've personally switched to just using Gmail's web interface for email
> myself, but I think that these discussions of which email protocol to use
> are unnecessary in this case. As was originally stated in the first email,
>
> Web usage and email are not included in the data cap, but downloads and
>> streaming are.​

Thanks for that reminder but I found the original statement confusing. How does the ISP know what to count as "web usage?" Traffic on standard email ports is easy to identify (though I wonder if the exclusion is limited to the email service provided by the ISP) but HTTP and HTTPS are very commonly used for "downloads" and streaming of audio and video. The ISP already most likely misidentified Steve's bandwidth usage as "iTunes streaming" when it was more likely one or more Apple iCloud services. Presumably Netflix, Hulu, and Apple's Beats1 count as streaming but does YouTube? What about Facebook, is that web usage or is it "streaming" if you watch a lot of videos hosted there. Selectively charging for bandwidth based on the host probably goes against the FCC's current net neutrality rules.




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Re: High bandwidth usage in Yosemite and/or iOS 8

Peter Lane
The HughesNet Satelite service I have with same 15 GB limit considers data is data. No differentiation between types of data. Shooting it up to geosynchronous orbit and back it all looks the same.

Sent from my iPad

> On Aug 7, 2015, at 10:03 AM, Curtis Wilcox <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Aug 7, 2015, at 9:47 AM, Doug Miller <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> ​I've personally switched to just using Gmail's web interface for email
>> myself, but I think that these discussions of which email protocol to use
>> are unnecessary in this case. As was originally stated in the first email,
>>
>> Web usage and email are not included in the data cap, but downloads and
>>> streaming are.​
>
> Thanks for that reminder but I found the original statement confusing. How does the ISP know what to count as "web usage?" Traffic on standard email ports is easy to identify (though I wonder if the exclusion is limited to the email service provided by the ISP) but HTTP and HTTPS are very commonly used for "downloads" and streaming of audio and video. The ISP already most likely misidentified Steve's bandwidth usage as "iTunes streaming" when it was more likely one or more Apple iCloud services. Presumably Netflix, Hulu, and Apple's Beats1 count as streaming but does YouTube? What about Facebook, is that web usage or is it "streaming" if you watch a lot of videos hosted there. Selectively charging for bandwidth based on the host probably goes against the FCC's current net neutrality rules.
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