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Problem

Dundas I. Flaherty-2
A friend described a problem to me to see if I had a solution. He has a ranch with an office that has FiOS internet service. The home is about 300 yards away. Verizon has said they can’t run a FiOS line from the office to the home. There’s line-of-sight between the office and the home with just a wooden barn interrupting the line of sight. They’d like to have internet service in the home. Does anyone know of a good way to do that? Wireless would be ideal, but they could bury a wired solution if necessary. Cost isn’t important.

Suggestions invited.

Thannks!

Dan Flaherty


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Re: Problem

Bill Rausch
On 8/24/17 9:00 PM, Dundas I. Flaherty wrote:
> ... They’d like to have internet service in the home. Does anyone know of a good way to do that? Wireless would be ideal, but they could bury a wired solution if necessary. Cost isn’t important.
>
> Suggestions invited.
>
Since cost isn't the main issue, I'd pull a fiber line through conduit.
Normal Ethernet copper is limited to about 100 yards.

The conduit could just be 1 1/4" plastic irrigation pipe; super cheap
and easy to install. Then put a vacuum cleaner on one end and a spool of
thread on the other and suck the thread through. Then tie it to a
fishing line and pull that through, then tie it to the fiber and
"carefully" pull that through. No sharp bends allowed. Total cost is a
couple of thousand dollars.

Bill


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Re: Problem

Randy B. Singer
In reply to this post by Dundas I. Flaherty-2

On Aug 24, 2017, at 9:00 PM, Dundas I. Flaherty wrote:

> A friend described a problem to me to see if I had a solution. He has a ranch with an office that has FiOS internet service. The home is about 300 yards away. Verizon has said they can’t run a FiOS line from the office to the home. There’s line-of-sight between the office and the home with just a wooden barn interrupting the line of sight. They’d like to have internet service in the home. Does anyone know of a good way to do that? Wireless would be ideal, but they could bury a wired solution if necessary. Cost isn’t important.

I have just the thing.  This is actually a problem that has come up several times.  However, the barn may be a problem depending on how it is situated.  

A pair of Nanostation M5s will usually create a fast and reliable wireless connection between buildings:

https://www.ubnt.com/airmax/nanostationm/


<https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00HXT8KJ4/>

or

https://is.gd/DVriMy


___________________________________________
Randy B. Singer
Co-author of The Macintosh Bible (4th, 5th, and 6th editions)

Macintosh OS X Routine Maintenance
http://www.macattorney.com/ts.html
___________________________________________






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Re: Problem

@lbutlr
In reply to this post by Bill Rausch

On 24 Aug 2017, at 22:21, Bill Rausch <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Then put a vacuum cleaner on one end and a spool of thread on the other and suck the thread through. Then tie it to a fishing line and pull that through, then tie it to the fiber and "carefully" pull that through. No sharp bends allowed. Total cost is a couple of thousand dollars.

Modern fibre is robust enough to be tied into a knot and still work just fine.

You can get 300m of double strand fiber for about $300, less if you are willing to deal with fleabay.

You will need a switch that supports fibre optic connections on each end (at the office and at the house).

--
Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.




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Re: Problem

Wim Wijnberg

I have been designing cable for underwater use (Seismic Cable for instance) since the mid eighties and, while I agree that a Fiber Optic can withstand some moderately sharp bends, temporarily, any bend with a radius less than 1" will cause problems after a while if left alone.  Fibers are best left straight or in bends with radii larger than 2 inches.

Anything smaller than that and bending strain will cause the minor surface cracks that are present in all fiber optics to grow, resulting in a premature death.


From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> on behalf of @lbutlr <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, August 28, 2017 3:11 PM
To: TidBITS Talk
Subject: Re: Problem
 

On 24 Aug 2017, at 22:21, Bill Rausch <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Then put a vacuum cleaner on one end and a spool of thread on the other and suck the thread through. Then tie it to a fishing line and pull that through, then tie it to the fiber and "carefully" pull that through. No sharp bends allowed. Total cost is a couple of thousand dollars.

Modern fibre is robust enough to be tied into a knot and still work just fine.

You can get 300m of double strand fiber for about $300, less if you are willing to deal with fleabay.

You will need a switch that supports fibre optic connections on each end (at the office and at the house).

--
Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.




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Re: Problem

Sam Silverman
I ran a crew installing, splicing and testing fibre optic cable in NYC in the late ‘90s and early ‘00s. When a tester wanted to verify that the splicer was on the right strand, they would have them gently 
bend it around their finger. If you were looking at the screen on the OTDR  (Optical Time Domain Refloctometer) when the cable got bent you could see the loss just drop through the floor.

Fibre can take a beating but bends should be kept large.We used to specify 1.25” or 1.5” pipe/tubing for fibre (I forget which) because you COULDN’t bend a radius that was too tight for the cable.

Sam
On Aug 28, 2017, at 5:10 PM, Wim Wijnberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

I have been designing cable for underwater use (Seismic Cable for instance) since the mid eighties and, while I agree that a Fiber Optic can withstand some moderately sharp bends, temporarily, any bend with a radius less than 1" will cause problems after a while if left alone.  Fibers are best left straight or in bends with radii larger than 2 inches.
Anything smaller than that and bending strain will cause the minor surface cracks that are present in all fiber optics to grow, resulting in a premature death.

From: [hidden email] <[hidden email]> on behalf of @lbutlr <[hidden email]>
Sent: Monday, August 28, 2017 3:11 PM
To: TidBITS Talk
Subject: Re: Problem
 

On 24 Aug 2017, at 22:21, Bill Rausch <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Then put a vacuum cleaner on one end and a spool of thread on the other and suck the thread through. Then tie it to a fishing line and pull that through, then tie it to the fiber and "carefully" pull that through. No sharp bends allowed. Total cost is a couple of thousand dollars.

Modern fibre is robust enough to be tied into a knot and still work just fine.

You can get 300m of double strand fiber for about $300, less if you are willing to deal with fleabay.

You will need a switch that supports fibre optic connections on each end (at the office and at the house).

-- 
Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.




____________TidBITS Talk Participation Guidelines____________
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Re: Problem

Fearghas McKay
In reply to this post by @lbutlr


On 28 Aug 2017, at 21:11, @lbutlr <[hidden email]> wrote:

You can get 300m of double strand fiber for about $300, less if you are willing to deal with fleabay.

If you run a pair I would use BiDirectional optics on it so you only use one fibre and have a spare. 

If you can I would run two pairs for redundancy and expansion. Getting somebody to blow the fibre down the ducting using the proper gear will save a lot of pain on a 100m length.

Cheers

f



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Re: Problem

@lbutlr
In reply to this post by Sam Silverman
On 28 Aug 2017, at 15:30, Sam Silverman <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I ran a crew installing, splicing and testing fibre optic cable in NYC in the late ‘90s and early ‘00s. When a tester wanted to verify that the splicer was on the right strand, they would have them gently
> bend it around their finger. If you were looking at the screen on the OTDR  (Optical Time Domain Refloctometer) when the cable got bent you could see the loss just drop through the floor.
>
> Fibre can take a beating but bends should be kept large.We used to specify 1.25” or 1.5” pipe/tubing for fibre (I forget which) because you COULDN’t bend a radius that was too tight for the cable.

Yes, this was true 20 years ago. It is not true NOW. Check out Corning's Clearcurve, for example (though they are not the only one).

<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxVMjmqoMBE>
<https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBt00CVvMBA>

--
Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.




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Re: Problem

Sam Silverman
Good to know!

> On Aug 28, 2017, at 9:59 PM, @lbutlr <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On 28 Aug 2017, at 15:30, Sam Silverman <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I ran a crew installing, splicing and testing fibre optic cable in NYC in the late ‘90s and early ‘00s. When a tester wanted to verify that the splicer was on the right strand, they would have them gently
>> bend it around their finger. If you were looking at the screen on the OTDR  (Optical Time Domain Refloctometer) when the cable got bent you could see the loss just drop through the floor.
>>
>> Fibre can take a beating but bends should be kept large.We used to specify 1.25” or 1.5” pipe/tubing for fibre (I forget which) because you COULDN’t bend a radius that was too tight for the cable.
>
> Yes, this was true 20 years ago. It is not true NOW. Check out Corning's Clearcurve, for example (though they are not the only one).
>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FxVMjmqoMBE>
> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UBt00CVvMBA>
>
> --
> Apple broke AppleScripting signatures in Mail.app, so no random signatures.
>
>
>
>
> ____________TidBITS Talk Participation Guidelines____________
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> Be polite and constructive, and comment on posts, not people.
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